Wednesday, November 12, 2025

More discussion on Red Vienna's housing program

 So...I did a bit more research into that red vienna housing program and while it seems nice in some ways there are definitely some things I dont like about it.

First, even the commenters on the first video I referenced (at least at the place I found it) with mamdani were quick to point out that vienna hasnt had much population growth over the past century, and has actually declined in population, so....that's a thing. And that makes a huge difference. Its easier to have affordable housing when you have population growth. 

Second, while the program is good for renters, it's TERRIBLE for homeowners. The fact that the government owns most housing in the city makes it darned near impossible to own one's home there. Given home ownership is an important aspect of the American system (it is "the american dream" after all), yeah, I'm not really sold on this. I dont want to turn america into a country of just renters. I want people to own their own homes if they can. Rental markets are fine for short term use, but long term, I'd like to see ownership. 

Third, racism ruins everything. In America, we have a lot of exclusionary housing practices and the reason suburbs are as they are is to keep "certain people" out and to keep population density low. However, this is a high density housing project. Also, In Europe, with the migrant crisis over there, Vienna has gotten quite exclusionary to immigrants in order to keep the system stable for long term residents. While I admit, any program i'd be for here would obviously be intended to primarily favor citizens and long term residents over newer immigrants, as that's what's needed for economic stability, again, I can't help but feel there's an undercurrent of racism here underlying a lot of peoples' motivations. I really wonder if Europe's general social safety nets will survive the strain the EU and the migrant situation are putting on the situation, or whether much like America, Europe will decide racism is more important than the public good. 

Now, New York is already pretty multiracial, so maybe the problem won't apply as much there. That's to mamdani's credit, but I've also been looking at this stuff in order to help inform my own national housing policy and yeah, I'm not entirely sure this could work. A huge reason a lot of existing public housing fails is because of racism and the programs being underfunded, causing the housing itself to decay until it is unusable and has to be demolished. 

Like, these programs are complicated. And people are complicated. And people seem to screw things up. This is why most of my programs are intended to be as simple and universal as possible. I try to make those systems hard to break. But housing is just another whole animal to jump into here. Like, UBI, universal healthcare, free college, all pretty easy to figure out (although to be fair, racism seems to ruin those things too when people prioritize racism above the public good). But again, housing just is...a mess. You got nimbyism, you got what kinds of housing to build, in what areas, etc. The Vienna model has some interesting aspects to it, but yeah I'm not sure it could just easily be applied to America. Again, with Mamdani's vision, it's probably not terrible, at least the way he wants to implement it, but eh....yeah, I'm not really a fan of a 50%+ socialist housing market that screws over the home ownership. I'm not sure if the plan works with population growth. And it needs a long term commitment from the government to keep it working, which, in america, given half the country believes in sabotaging ideas like this, is not helpful to its prospects. 

It's a mess. I'll keep researching, as I'm kinda at that point in my other project I want to beef up my housing ideas, but yeah, this issue really is a hot mess.  

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