Pushing back against a forum user who considers me a "fascist"

 So, as I recently pointed out, I was banned from one of my favorite online communities recently because I'm too liberal for them now, and don't approve of protest methods that do illegal things, and think police arrests of protesters is justified given the circumstances. Apparently that makes me a genocide supporter in the eyes of the one moderator who did it. 

But I do still surf the sub and came across this comment from a user I had blocked, and he was clearly talking about me, and I wanted to respond to it personally on here. He won't see this as he IS blocked, and I have no intention of engaging with him, but I do want to engage with the content of the idea since this kind of charged language is a bit incendiary and off.

There was a fascist on this subreddit who was banned a couple days ago. I saw them for what they were 5 or 6 months ago. They were initially talking about how Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East (trademark). I pointed out that it is an apartheid state.

They were probably against what the Houthis have been doing. Just a few days ago they were banned because they were talking about how college campuses are private property and students don't have a right to protest.

Genocide isn't acceptable so the pro-Israel people try to find ways to support Israel without explicit support for Israel and this means opposing groups that oppose Israel such as college students and the Houthis. It is just shifting strategy nearly 7 months into the genocide.

Surprisingly enough, the fascist who was banned has said they have 101 priorities and Palestine isn't one of them. It almost feels like they are trying to sound like they are cool and above it all, all while trying to sound like a Jay Z song from two decades ago.

  I'm gonna go over it again line by line, but that's the whole thing.

There was a fascist on this subreddit who was banned a couple days ago.

 First of all, I'm not a fascist, i'm a liberal, but these guys don't seem to know the difference. No literally. They unironically repeat the "scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds" line. Heck this whole discussion was just badmouthing liberals for daring to have different concerns and causes or being against the blatant incivility leftists often engage in.

I saw them for what they were 5 or 6 months ago.

 You mean you were one of those psychotic posters who had to get in my face and harass me for the cardinal sin of not making Palestine my #1 issue and not caring about it as much as you do.

If this person hypothetically read this blog, he might be interested in my discussion about how you can't force someone to care. And screaming at people and acting like a psychopath doesn't endear people do me, it makes me double down on my existing perspective. 

You also might be interested in the OG version where I came off as a bit more autistic and spiritual. 

But yeah I recognize being a bit different than a leftist and I always have been. My worldview is different, my ethics are based on different principles, and while I largely come to the same conclusions as the left 80% of the time, I do so from a different way.

They were initially talking about how Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East (trademark).

 I mean, it is the only country that really espouses liberal values in the middle east like democracy, yes. Israel is FAR closer to western liberal values than any other country. I have been corrected on this point though and will say that Turkey is also a democracy, although they seem a bit less liberal in my estimation.So that point wasn't truly accurate, but yeah.

Other than that, most of the middle east is illiberal theocracies and the like. And I'm sorry, this is a flaw of the modern left, but the left has a problem of defending and sympathizing with islamic extremists who are illiberal in their morality. Seriously, these guys are worse than the christian fundies in our own country. To see the left defending them because of their intersectionality BS is a waste.

Now, with that said, am I really a fan of zionism or zionists? No. I'm not. They're also religious radicals, but they're also religious radicals who despite their flaws are still more compatible with liberal values. So they're the "lesser evil" so to speak.

I pointed out that it is an apartheid state. 

 In a sense it is, but if one looks at the history, it comes off to me that they were forced into it by the fact that they are radical extremists who will commit acts of terror if they are not walled in. If you study the history of israel as a state objectively, and I've done a lot of reading and research on the subject since the conflict began, you'll see that Israel has tried to be reasonable with palestine, and they even let some palestinians in to become citizens. But many have no interest in becoming Israeli citizens or coming to a state of peace. They're radicalized nutcases who want to kill Israelis. So Israelis built walls around them and act like an apartheid state. 

This isn't to say israel is innocent. I do think that the zionist hardliners there do want to mistreat and kill palestinians. And I have become quite critical of the Netanyahu government since this war has stated. I don't think they're always acting in good faith. 

Honestly, there are bad faith actors on both sides. And it's kind of why I've given up on this issue. The fighting will only stop when the sides agree to let it stop. And neither side wants to budge. And this isn't my problem.

And that's the thing. I can recognize Israel isn't perfect while also being nominally pro Israel. I can disagree with the policies of the current government while also supporting Israel's right to exist. I can sympathize with the unnecessary destruction of Palestinian lives, while also not really being sympathetic to palestine as an entity. This user doesn't seem to get that, nor does he have nuance at all.

They were probably against what the Houthis have been doing.

 You mean the radical terrorists who were indiscriminately attacking ships that went past Yemen trying to go to or from the Suez Canal?

And that's the thing. I don't support terrorism. Period. I don't care how good your cause is, I'm not gonna support radicals who attack people. 

Just a few days ago they were banned because they were talking about how college campuses are private property and students don't have a right to protest. 

 I mean, they are on private property. And students don't have a right to UNLAWFULLY protest in ways that obstruct the functioning of the colleges at hand. They can't just occupy buildings or set up tent cities or intimidate Jewish students. What these guys have been doing flies in the face of actual first amendment protections.

I might call myself a near free speech absolutist, but my opinions largely follow that of the first amendment and its legal concerns. And while the court does sometimes overstep and I've been critical of certain rulings (for example, using the "clear and present danger" logic against Eugene Debbs, or being anti porn), I mostly see their rulings as reasonable and believe there's a good faith attempt by them to maximize the amount of actual freedom people have while also recognizing that some limitations have to actually exist for the basic functioning of society. And that's what we're talking about here.

Is it okay for protesters to just obstruct things because they have a point to make? No. But these leftists kinda ask for police presence and crack downs. They go into these protests with the idea that the obstruction is the point. That you can't have a good protest unless you're getting in peoples' face and obstructing stuff. And with that attitude, yeah, throw the book at them, sorry, not sorry. 

Genocide isn't acceptable so the pro-Israel people try to find ways to support Israel without explicit support for Israel and this means opposing groups that oppose Israel such as college students and the Houthis. It is just shifting strategy nearly 7 months into the genocide.

 I mean, you can support Israel without supporting genocide, and I try to operate under the assumptions that I support Israel in the larger conflict and greater arc of history morally, while simultaneously being deeply critical of the Netanyahu government and certain actions taken along the way. And I don't think this is an uncommon opinion among liberals. Biden has criticized Netanyahu, Chuck Schumer has too. Bernie is being extremely critical right now, kind of bridging the divide between the far left and the libs lately. Heck I've even heard conservatives like Alex Jones and Stephen Crowder be critical of Israel. It's kind of the commonplace opinion these days that what Israel is doing is BAD. And there is widespread condemnation of the Netanyahu government across the political spectrum.

What makes the left get so much negative attention is their willingness to use uncivil and illegal means to make their point, including screaming at public officials at public functions, blocking roads, and occupying college campuses. 

You can have a good point while protesting civilly. No one is criticizing people who do that. What we're criticizing are the whackjobs who think that it's okay to break the law or acting uncivilly because they have a point to make.

Also, the other thing that's getting the pro palestine protesters in hot water with me and the larger public is many of them straight up SUPPORT TERRORISTS. This guy is defending the fricking Houthis.

 

 And you know what? The support that these people have for Palestine goes well beyond just caring about the well being of Palestinian civilians. Many of them straight up support Hamas. They support the terrorism against Israel. They see Israel as a settler colonial state that is illegal and unjust and should be abolished. Never mind this would create a humanitarian crisis on a scale much larger than the current one, but they literally support Palestine as a legal entity occupying the land.

Many of them when criticized about this will back off and say they support a "two state solution" or "from the river to the sea isnt anti semitic", but idk, just like this guy can see through my motives to know that at the end of the day I am pro Israel more than pro Palestine, I kinda understand that many of these guys are perfectly okay with terrorist organizations and even potentially the genocide of the Israeli people. They're psychos. 

Surprisingly enough, the fascist who was banned has said they have 101 priorities and Palestine isn't one of them. It almost feels like they are trying to sound like they are cool and above it all, all while trying to sound like a Jay Z song from two decades ago.

 Yeah I admit I kinda did do a bit of an edgy thing like the song. And I've expressed similar views on here. But you know what? Sometimes, when dealing with your favorite community being taken over by weirdo radicals for 6 months, you kinda have to. These guys wanna literally protest vote against Biden over this. They are making this their ride and die issue above all else. They're so myopic that they're willing to throw out any and all progress, including those made on my own top priorities, and throw the election to trump, over THIS. And I'm sorry, i didn't sign up for that in 2016. 

I am so sick of radical leftists, and SJWs just deciding to hijack political causes and drive them into the dirt over this BS social justice stuff. And yes, the obsessive gaza humanitarianism is part of that too. 

As I said, I get my logic from the asch experiment. Sometimes you need someone to actually speak out and break the circlejerk in order to break people out of literal group think. And my goals aren't aligned with this group think. I don't care about gaza at the end of the day. It's not a top issue, it's probably not even in my top 50. As we can see it's probably in the bottom 80th-90th percentile somewhere. it sucks, I get it, i dont like what's going on either, but I look at it like an RPG decision. 

I mean, in a lot of RPGs, you get these moral dilemmas. You get two factions that are both flawed that both wanna kill each other, and sometimes you, the player, have to decide which one lives and which one dies. You can, in some instances, with high enough charisma, work out some end all be all of deals, but normally, unless you have the proper skill set to unlock the proper options to do this, if there even IS a peaceful option, you end up having to choose which faction you side with. You cant side with both. 

And that's kinda all I'm going with being a little more pro Israel than Palestine.

Still, at the end of the day, this doesn't affect me, and I kinda just prefer to walk away and not formally endorse either side, or maybe just continue providing Israel with defensive arms like iron dome while condemning the wanton violence. 

Either way, me, "the player" aint invested enough in the outcome here where I just wanna walk away and focus on anything else. But sadly, this conflict is dark and ugly and seems to bring the worst of humanity out on all sides, so I'm forced to put up with people going all in on this being their #1 issue and blah blah blah.

I'm just trying to encourage people to think about, you know, anything else. I keep telling them, you know biden is trying to forgive student debt, and these guys turn around and are like "well F student debt". You might as well just say "F me and my concerns" at that point, which doesnt endear me to you. I mean Biden tried to push for build back better and we got the inflation reduction act. He tried to push for the child tax credit that cut child poverty in half and was a proof of concept for UBI. The dude supported a $15 minimum wage and all sorts of pro union legislation.

I'm not the kind of dude who is gonna outright voter shame people for thinking differently, but I am gonna tell them what's at stake if they don't vote for Biden, and what progress they're throwing away. And I hate to say it, but if they'll throw away all of that because of some conflict in the middle east that barely concerns us, well, you're no ally of mine, and just like with the SJWs, I'm going to put myself first. You cant manipulate me, you cant guilt me, you can't shame me, you can't force people to care. And you know what? If I get banned for sticking true to my principles, well, screw you too.

And that's my opinion on this guy, and that sub in general. Screw them. 

Now to be fair, nothing against a certain moderator I had a decent relationship with, you know who you are if you read this, so i do wanna walk this back just a tiny bit to recognize that guy, but other than that, yeah, I'm done, screw those guys. 

My convictions are my convictions, my goals are my goals, you can't change my opinions through self righteous screeching. 

I just wanted to respond to this guy in some form and explain my views to a more reasonable audience.